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we know now is the i.r.s., including mr. miller, lied to congress, lied to me, more importantly, lied to the american people and saying there was no such political targeting going on. >> schieffer: well, from what you know about it now, do you think this was something that was just generated within the i.r.s. or do you think they were acting on orders from somebody else? well, that's where i think the culture or the environment that the administration has created here, that it's okay to cover things up, it's okay to intimidate your political adversaries is important. you've been around bureaucracies a long time as i have, and bureaucratics don't take risk unless they have a signal implicit or implicit from higher ups you're doing exactly what we expect you to do. i have a very hard time to believe this was cooked up in cincinnati by midlevel employees at the i.r.s. >> schieffer: let me ask you about the leak case. the associate press had a story about how the c.i.a. had broken up a terrorist plot to put bombs on aircraft. it was a good story that would have reflected well-- did reflec
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